Tuesday, June 1, 2010

This house would abolish compulsory retirement - Opening Speeches

First Proposing Speech
Dear readers, welcome to this debate where we are going to show you why we should abolish compulsory retirement. First of all, what does the word retirement mean for us? We are simply going to define it as the act of leaving your job to start collecting your pension. We hope there is no need to define compulsory or abolish, that all readers know these terms without problem...

First opposing speech
In this debate, me, and then my teammates from the opposing team, are going to show you that abolish compulsory retirement would be a huge mistake.

I think the words of the motion don’t need to be explained. Indeed, this motion takes part in the burning issue of what should we do to save our retirement system in France. And this is for this reason that I will particularly consider the French political and economical context (nowadays, in France, unless you are self-employed, you must retire at the age of sixty.)...

First Proposing Speech
Dear readers, welcome to this debate where we are going to show you why we should abolish compulsory retirement. First of all, what does the word retirement mean for us? We are simply going to define it as the act of leaving your job to start collecting your pension. We hope there is no need to define compulsory or abolish, that all readers know these terms without problem.

Our exposition, will be divided in two axes: we think that compulsory retirement is not just bad for the state, which has to pay the bill of the pensions of the retired people, but is also a nonsense for those people, like doctors, physicians or other specialists who are in the best moment of their career and who want to continue their job, because it’s their passion, and because they can offer a lot to the society, thanks to their knowledge and their experience.

Financial and demographic flaws of the retirement system

Fixed retirement age is a kind of anachronism today. We do not have as an enormous labor force as we did on the 50’s and 60’s, when our retirement system was introduced. The demographic conditions have clearly changed: we live longer and better, we have fewer children, and our working environment has improved, so it comes up that a reform of the retirement system would just be natural, and necessary, and that the old system of compulsory age of retirement should be questioned.

Moreover, the cost of the current system strains the state. The bill of the actual retirement system is huge, and we are not able to assure the future of the pensions of our children anymore. Besides, we should look at the reforms that the other countries are introducing nowadays. In Spain for example, the retirement age is a right, but not an obligation, and it has been replaced by the age of 67. Germany changed the age of retirement some months ago to make it 2 or 3 years longer. In the United States, compulsory retirement at the age of 65 was practiced during the 20th century and was abolished due to age discrimination. So, at this point, let me ask the reader: how long is it going to take until the systems cracks, if we do not abolish compulsory retirement, just like many have countries successfully done?

People’s opinion and brain drain

Now, tell us: why should we pay oversized amounts of money to finance the retirement of a person who maybe wanted to continue working, because it would allow him to earn more, or simply because this person likes his job? Imposing a retirement age is implicitly saying that your job is necessarily a burden for you, and that the goal of every worker in the country is to stop working as soon as possible! However, because working conditions have improved, and because the average level of study has increased, many people do like their job, and are not especially in a hurry to leave it. Besides, retiring does not always mean starting an exciting period of funny holidays: retired people often don’t earn enough to be able to fulfill their dreams of travels and other exciting experiences, and just start boring, and thinking only about old age, illness and death, while going on working would have allowed them to keep a real social life, recognition and stimulating activities.

We talked about finance and the economy of the state, but you also have to consider people and their needs. Although retirement has to be part of our social system to prevent workers from exploitation and assure the living conditions of the elderly people, a compulsory age of retirement is not the solution because it comes up to introduce a brain drain. We already said that many people liked their job, and did not want to leave it. In particular, there are plenty of examples of great Scientifics who left their country because it was imposing them to retire, to go to another country where they could work as long as they wanted to. Doctors that made a reputation during all their life are forced to leave their own country, which loses a great intellectual potential.

It’s for all these reasons that the compulsory retirement is a discrimination of age and damages the society and the perception we have of our government and of work generally. So, if you like to be free to take your own decisions and to manage your life as you want, vote for us.

Clarisse and Javier

First opposing speech
In this debate, me, and then my teammates from the opposing team, are going to show you that abolish compulsory retirement would be a huge mistake.

I think the words of the motion don’t need to be explained. Indeed, this motion takes part in the burning issue of what should we do to save our retirement system in France. And this is for this reason that I will particularly consider the French political and economical context (nowadays, in France, unless you are self-employed, you must retire at the age of sixty.).

To begin with, I am going to make a rebuttal to a common argument that I fear to read. Indeed, I do not want it to become the centre of this debate because I think it does not fit the motion. Do not tell me that, nowadays, considering all the problems we have in France to find money for retired people, it would be ridiculous to prevent people from working older. Actually, in this debate, I am not going to defend that we should not increase the age of compulsory retirement, because I think it would be a good thing to save our system. I will only promote that we still have to maintain an age of compulsory retirement, and I am now going to tell you why.

Firstly, in Europe, we live in a society where the number of old people keeps increasing. All the wise men, and there are a great many wise people in the staff of Centrale Paris School, defend that the future is built on innovation. So, I am asking you, dear readers, do you think that it is a good thing to let people work very old? And, do not make me say what I am not saying. I am not trying to convince you that old people cannot find innovative ideas. I just want to say that as we get older we become less confident in the future and in the consequences of our decisions, and then we have a tendency to preserve our small humdrum routine. On the contrary, as an example, a young person fired from a society because he had made the wrong choice knows he has time to recover his reputation and save his career.

Furthermore, dear readers, we all know the plague of unemployment allowances in France. They are ruining the nation and permit a lot of unemployed people to take pleasure (Do not think I am saying that every people out of job is like that, because I know it is wrong), earning approximately the same as someone having a menial job. Thus, I think that by imposing an age of compulsory retirement we will let the place for those who seem not able to find a job. People are asking for more work? Let us give them a job, and you will allow the older ones to enjoy their retirement instead of permitting younger ones to enjoy their unemployment. In addition to that, I know that our population is getting older, but for those who enter the working world, it would be good to know that some places are still vacant.

For the values of national growth and work that my teammates will continue to defend, dear readers, make the right decision, and vote for us.

Paul R.

9 comments:

  1. Interesting arguments on both sides.

    Just one question though, for the proposers, who talk about scientists leaving the country because they are forced to retire. How much truly excellent work in sciences has been produced by people over 65? Einstein had published both special and general theories of relativity by the age of 36. What exactly was gained by allowing him to remain in his chair at Princeton until his death? Would you really want your nearest and dearest to be operated on by a surgeon of over 80 whose eyesight is not good and whose hand/eye coordination isn't good? If there is no compulsory retirement age, how can you stop someone from working who is very evidently growing incompetent/senile but who won't admit it?

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  2. The director of the institute Marie-Curie who is one of the better scientists in genetics was forced to leave the institution due to his age. Hopefully our american friends gave him the direction of one of the bests laboratories in the country.

    I'm sorry to don't be able to remember his name, I read this on the news 2 or 3 years ago.

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  3. Interesting but your examples all come from a very narrow spectrum of occupations. What about industry workers? The abolishment of compulsory retirement could just be a stepping stone toward the abolishment of the right to retire for all sorts of workers for whom retirement means the end of a long ordeal. What about them? How are their interests to be defended?

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  4. I think the second argument of paul is very important. However,you should have developped it a little more.
    I think that if you did that, and talked a little more about the cycles in the economy, about the long term effect (if you abolish compulsory retirement ==>unemployement in the youth==>in 20 years, young men with no qualifications and skills required==> rebutal of the argument about the need of expierence of old men) it would have been perfect.

    However I still believe this was an excellent speach!
    nice job

    Paul G

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  5. I believe the Proposers have the stronger position so far, by their invocation of basic human freedoms. If an individual wishes to pursue his professional life beyond an arbitrarily designated age-limit, and an employer wishes to employ him/her, by what right does the State intervene and prevent them from entering into their freely-decided contract? The only argument I can see is that of "the greater good of society": by forcing this worker to retire, society prevents him/her from taking an occupation from a younger, and thereby more worthy worker: a clearly discriminatory position. And one relying on an illusory Malthusian vision of work.

    MP

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  6. "ME and my teammates"?!

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  7. MP :
    "by what right does the State intervene and prevent them from"
    this is the role of the state!!!

    JMcD :
    We are in the french system ...our english is far from being good

    Paul g

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  8. @ paul

    The State certainly has the power to interfere with individual free choice, but not thereby the right to do so, unless it is in defence of other individuals, or "society at large", who would be harmed by that choice. My point is that in the present case there is no such harm, unless you consider work to be a scarce resource like oil or air. Perhaps it is, or perhaps there are other harms that would justify state intervention here, but I haven't been persuaded of this yet. Hence my calling this measure "discriminatory".

    MP

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  9. @ Mp:
    I may not have the same conception of the state. Maybe it is a problem of culture and influences.
    I do believe that it is the role of the government to state whether or not a national issue overrides the issues of every social group.

    So in my mind, if the state judges that abolishing compulsory age of retirement is a necessity for the country, he has the right to do so. The opposition in the parlement is here to offer another point of view, and to stimulate people and the media against this decision.

    Paul g

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